#1368 - Edward Snowden
NaN minutesEpisode #1368
Edward Snowden is an American whistleblower who copied and leaked highly classified information from the National Security Agency in 2013 when he was a Central Intelligence Agency employee and subcontractor. His new book "Permanent Record" is now available.
Episodes with Edward Snowden
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Episode Timestamps
Edward Snowden Talks About 'Permanent Record' and Government Lawsuit
- Edward Snowden discusses his book 'Permanent Record' which delves into technology and government changes post-9/11.
- The government files a lawsuit against Snowden and his publisher to prevent the book's circulation.
- Snowden reflects on the challenges of getting his message out amidst government censorship efforts.
Edward Snowden Exposes Unconstitutional Mass Surveillance Programs
- Snowden reveals details about the mass surveillance programs 'Stellar Wind' which monitored phone calls, emails, and internet communications.
- Government officials led by Dick Cheney authorized the surveillance without disclosing legal justifications.
- The surveillance program eroded constitutional rights without public knowledge or oversight.
Whistleblowing on Government Surveillance Programs
- Government class vs. public civil class standards of behavior
- Exposing criminal or unconstitutional activities by government
- Challenging the system of checks and balances
Adversarial Collaboration in Government Surveillance Disclosure
- Strict conditions for journalist publication
- Consulting the government before publishing
- Importance of minimizing risks and maximizing public benefit
Michael Hayden's Order & Chaos at the NSA
- Michael Hayden, then director of NSA, ordered evacuation of thousands of personnel from the campus.
- Confusion and chaos ensue as a mass evacuation is carried out at NSA headquarters.
- Significant concern arises as the gravity of the situation becomes apparent post-evacuation.
Intelligence Community's Risk Assessment
- Intelligence agencies prioritize risk management over potential threats post-911 attacks.
- Decisions made based on perceived risks rather than concrete evidence of targeted attacks.
- Bureaucratic procedures and risk aversion lead to lapses in information sharing and prevention efforts.
Interagency Competition and Lack of Cooperation in Counterterrorism Efforts
- Various government agencies like CIA, FBI, and NSA were not sharing crucial information regarding a major terrorist plot.
- The competition for credit and promotions among different agencies led to a lack of cooperation.
- The desire to be the hero who thwarted the plot overshadowed the need for collaboration.
Reactions to Terrorism, Leadership in Times of Fear, and Historical Context
- After 9/11, the fear of terrorism led to a desire for safety and decisive action.
- The historical context of political longevity in authoritarian regimes is highlighted.
- The vulnerability of societies during times of fear and the risks of following leaders promising solutions.
Injuries in the Army and Administrative Discharge
- Suffered bilateral tibial fractures during training, faced the choice of continuing or taking an administrative discharge.
- Accepted administrative discharge which exempted the Army from liability for injuries.
- Received medical treatment but realized consequences of discharge on future health coverage.
Transition to NSA and CIA Roles
- Transitioned to a security guard position at a University of Maryland NSA facility.
- Progressed to working for CIA at night overseeing key technical systems.
- Recruited for overseas mission, landed in Geneva as a tech guide, started questioning CIA tactics.
Edward Snowden's Misgivings and Ambitious Idea
- Edward Snowden's initial misgivings regarding government practices.
- Reassignment to the Office of Information Sharing in Hawaii due to a contracting mishap.
- Development of an ambitious project called Heartbeat to connect intelligence community records.
Discovery of Stellar Wind and Government's Surveillance Program
- Edward Snowden's access to highly classified information due to privileged status.
- Discovery of the domestic mass surveillance program called Stellar Wind.
- Background on the scandal involving the Bush White House and the New York Times.
Protect America Act - 2007 Legislation and its Consequences
- White House implicated powerful members of Congress in criminal activity, leading to Congress passing the Protect America Act in 2007.
- Law retroactively immunized phone companies for unlawfully handing over records to the government.
- Companies pushed for legal protection to avoid lawsuits and law passed under emergency with claims of public safety fears.
FISA Amendments Act of 2008 - Expansion of Intelligence Community Powers
- Congress passed the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act Amendments in 2008, expanding intelligence community powers.
- Rather than stopping unlawful activities, new laws created legal ways to continue questionable practices.
- Government altered laws to suit agency activities rather than making agencies comply with the law, leading to increased powers.
Government Abuse of Power: FBI, CIA, NSA
- FBI spied on Martin Luther King Jr. and classified him as national security threat
- Government agencies like FBI, CIA, and NSA abused their powers and did harm to domestic politics
- Patriotism is about doing good for the people, not blind loyalty to the government
Privacy and Surveillance in a Connected World
- Technology enables unprecedented connectivity but raises concerns about privacy
- Government surveillance under the guise of protection raises constitutional and privacy issues
- Importance of distinguishing between legitimate and illegitimate secrets in national security
Whistleblower's Struggle Against Government Secrecy
- Government secrecy and broken system highlighted by Snowden's revelations
- Legal hurdles faced by Snowden in proving existence of classified programs
- Challenges in the court system due to lack of concrete evidence and state secrets defense
Implications of Classified Surveillance Programs
- Government charges under Espionage Act for revealing public interest information
- Recognition of leaks as beneficial by post-2013 court rulings
- Citizens' right to know challenged by pervasive government surveillance
Edward Snowden on Being Recognized
- Despite efforts to remain unidentified, Snowden is recognized sporadically, showcasing people's strong memory for faces.
- He gets recognized even when disguised, like in computer stores, possibly due to a technological association.
- Snowden values privacy and prefers not to be a celebrity, expressing discomfort with being recognized.
The Critical Legal Battle of Edward Snowden
- Snowden highlights the unfair legal treatment of whistleblowers under the Espionage Act, emphasizing the denial of a public interest defense.
- He calls for the ability for juries to consider whistleblowers' motivations, which is currently prohibited under the strict liability nature of the law.
- The government restricts whistleblowers from discussing the reasons behind their actions, limiting the essence of a fair trial.
Edward Snowden's Stand for Justice in Russia
- Edward Snowden expresses willingness to return home but highlights the possibility of being kicked out due to his stand against Russian government actions.
- Reflecting on the risks involved, Snowden emphasizes the importance of speaking out against injustices, even in the face of potential danger.
- Snowden's belief in individual actions contributing to a collective change is highlighted through the metaphor of laying one brick at a time towards a better future.
The Evolution of Surveillance and Mobile Privacy
- Snowden discusses the shift towards mobile-first surveillance and the lack of privacy in Apple and Android devices.
- Detailed insight into the constant connection of smartphones to cellular towers and the creation of records of individuals' movements.
- The implications of big data in storing personal information and the erosion of privacy in the digital age are highlighted.
Bulk Collection and Mass Surveillance Impact on Personal Data
- Bulk collection and mass surveillance lead to storing personal data without individuals' awareness.
- Data from various phone interactions and apps is collected in advance.
- Global unique identifiers in devices allow tracking through location services, GPS, and wireless access points.
Lack of Visibility and Control in Smartphone Data Usage
- Smartphones constantly communicate with servers without users' clear knowledge.
- Difficulty in monitoring and controlling app-level network connections.
- Need for making devices' activities more visible and controllable by users.
Smith versus Maryland: Legal Paradigm and Mass Surveillance
- Legal paradigm allows companies to change agreements unilaterally without user consent
- Third party doctrine derived from the case Smith versus Maryland
- Precedent set that records collected about individuals belong to companies, not individuals
John Perrig Barlow's Privacy Philosophy
- People awakening to the exploitation of data and loss of privacy
- Companies and governments resisting acknowledgment of privacy concerns
- Quote from John Perrig Barlow: 'You can't awaken someone who's pretending to be asleep'